Sunday, May 02, 2010

Rape of woman in skinny jeans not possible

CAN a woman wearing skinny jeans be raped? Or are they so tight they can be taken off only with her consent?

These are some of the questions a jury asked before acquitting a Sydney man of sexual assault.

Quite right. It isn't rape by any reasonable definition unless the woman resists to the best of her ability, and such resistance would obviously make it impossible to remove her jeans without leaving a mark. The only way a woman can legitimately consider herself raped without fighting to the best of her ability is if doing so would likely get her or someone she commonly protects killed or seriously injured. Since the woman does not even accuse the man of threatening her with anything in this case, this is certainly not rape even if she is telling the truth.

This is a victory for men, albeit an isolated one in a hateful climate of feminist corruption of justice, and I'm sure feminists will only redouble their efforts to convict more men falsely accused of rape. I don't know if they have double jeopardy in Australia, but if they do, Nicholas Eugenio Gonzalez will almost certainly be convicted upon appeal. In Norway we actually have triple jeopardy, at least. A man can be acquitted twice and then the professional feminist judges can set aside the jury's verdict and order a new trial with fewer jurors and this happens because that's how arrogant the feminist justice system is. The legal definition of rape is vastly more inclusive than what your peers including non-feminist women consider to be rape, so a jury will frequently acquit despite the man clearly being guilty by the feminist legal definition. The final solution is to abolish the jury, which feminists are lobbying for as we speak, and meanwhile they will disrespect the jury whenever it refuses to convict a man accused of rape. Norwegian men ultimately have no rights, nothing to stop feminists from rigging the system against men however they see fit. My guess is the jury will be gone relatively soon in rape cases.

Of course, even if we had some sort of sacred constitutional guaranteed right to a jury trial like Americans do, feminists would still find ways to rig the system against men and prevent us from getting a fair trial, as in rape shield laws and so on, withholding evidence from the jury to boost convictions. So either way feminists win and men lose. Until we start fighting back. The first step is to stop respecting women and not have any sympathy for actual rape victims either. I have at least reached that point. In fact, I gloat when a woman is actually raped. Since women and the law do not care if we actually rape and only care about obtaining convictions, we might as well get our money's worth.

81 comments:

Eurosabra said...

I feel really amazingly grim about this result, because of the way it has been treated on the Yes Means Yes blog, as jury nullification. In contrast, for an innocent man, pleading innocent and taking the case all the way to the jury, through indictment, arraignment, voir dire, and the trial itself is the only way to freedom. From a PUA perspective, the whole evening sucks, either he was the victim of a false accusation or he inflicted sexual torture on a woman who previously considered him a friend. Trying to have it off with one of your ex-girlfriend's friends who is trying to "console" you for the loss of your GF is a beta move, begging for sex (playing drums as a Demonstration of Higher Value?) in a one-down position AFTER a woman has prior-unselected you. On the other hand, what is it to meek mild me, who has always lived around women while having sex a few times a year every couple years, that a healthy young predator got his way on the other side of the world?

I would also point out that he was denied reparation of his court and defense costs by the State because in the opinion of the female Jewish feminist medical examiner and the female feminist judge the accusation was valid and not wholly unfounded solely because of the former's medical opinion of the victim's condition. Since he is a navy cook, I hope he is re-thinking his obligation to the State and citizenship on a very deep, let us say, "Hunt for Red October" level--"Because the state was responsible, the state would be made to pay."

Anonymous said...

Everything you have said on this topic Eivind makes me want to vomit.

Anonymous said...

You gloat when a woman is raped? And you're "not a misogynist"? Please.

Anonymous said...

Tell us about your mother. Do you like her?

Anonymous said...

wow seriously, you are one major douche.

Steveo said...

Anyone who can be so vindictive to say that he is happy when a woman is raped is a terrible person. False convictions happen all the time, and everytime, no matter what the accusation, its horrible. But your claims about how the justice system falsely convicts men of rape don't seem to be based on anything but your anger. Do you have any statistics to base this on? Any statistics that I have seen seem to show that most rapes are not reported, and even when they are, are very unlikely to lead to convictions. So please back up your anger and hatred of women with some facts.

Anonymous said...

you have no soul

Anonymous said...

Well.. this guy is 32 years old and still a student. I am also willing to bet on "single".

Hopefully he has moved out of his mom's basement, but he appears to have a few mommy issues.

Batcheeba said...

Have you ever "raped" anyone?
And if not, why not?

Journeyer said...

For all of you reading this ... person's ... blog that are of different nationality than norwegian I apologize profusely.

Please believe me when I state that this person's opinions does in no way reflect the opinions of our people as a whole, and that he effectively makes me ashamed to share a country with him.

~Red~ said...

I believe the news story explicitly stated that this girl weighed 90 pounds (aka, she was TINY). Skinny jeans may have been worn like HammerPants on this VICTIM.

That being said, you're a perfect representation of the cognitive bile that constitutes most of the Libertarian party. Congratulations.

Siv B. said...

What happened to make you so angry at women?

Trish said...

That's one mother of a chip you've got on your shoulder. Time to seek help and forgive whoever hurt you enough to make you such an angry, biased person.

Ian said...

holy shitting jesus you make me ashamed to be a man. i honestly hope you die soon.

Tim Holtorf said...

I read the first blog post, and this idiot's ranting made me sick. I can't believe there are people with such backwards views in the world.

Neil said...

You've never spoken to a girl in real life have you?

Anonymous said...

So, I bet you're a pretty big deal on XBox Live. Am I right?!

Seriously, dude. Get laid.

Anonymous said...

You don't think it's possible for a woman to be so terrified that they are basically unable to move? You think that if a woman doesn't put up a good enough fight, she deserves to be raped? You're a sick individual.

Anti-feminist = misogynist.

Deal with it.

Anonymous said...

These comments are so great.


Oh, and Eivind: kill yrself you fucking fuck.

Dayna said...

A woman is not required to do anything when she's being raped. Once she says no, game over. She doesn't HAVE to struggle, fight back, or anything. That's just how it works. I mean, once a man is having sex with a woman against her will, it's rape and nothing that she does or does not do at that point can change that.

I am really upset by whatever it is that is obviously deeply wrong with you. But I want you to know that many feminists are not out to get men and we would, in fact, prefer that no man was ever convicted of rape ever again---but men would need to stop raping women for that to happen.

Lemish said...

How tall are you? When do you plan on losing your virginity? Do you have nightmares about vaginas swallowing you whole?

Steveo said...

Although I agree with the sentiment of all of the comments, he is just going to wear these complaints as a badge of honour.

But Eivind, as a self professed libertarian, how can you support rape? Don't you believe that you shouldn't be coerced into doing anything? Rape is coercion. Way to be inconsistent with your beliefs, as well as a misogynist!

Alice said...

you're a fucking idiot. i am actually ashamed that you are a member of the same species as I.

Amanda said...

what the fuck is this. if she doesn't resist adequately it's not rape? where the fuck did you learn your moral fucking values you piece of shit?

Anonymous said...

http://worstpeopleawards.com/8-eivind-berge/

Eivind Berge said...

Amanda, if she does not resist adequately; that is, to the best of her ability, then she isn't being forced to have sex. She is letting it happen. Rape is not simply sex without consent. Rape is intercourse by force and without consent. That's how the law used to define it and until we quash feminist rape law reform I have no sympathy for so-called rape victims even if they are raped for real.

Anonymous said...

You´re mental as fuck. Get help. Otherwise you might as well abuse girl babies sooner or later, blaming them for "wanting it". Fuck you, antisocial ignorant. Fuck you.

Anonymous said...

i applaud you for posting all your info to your blog...you may as well carry around a can of vasoline because sooner or later you're going to get fucked in the ass for it...make sure you resist to the best of your ability

Anonymous said...

What kind of sick human being are you?

The Grim Optimist said...

"i applaud you for posting all your info to your blog...you may as well carry around a can of vasoline because sooner or later you're going to get fucked in the ass for it...make sure you resist to the best of your ability

Thu May 27, 11:39:00 PM CEST"

Well fookin' said!

Anonymous said...

1: Actually anti-feminist and misogynist are the same thing, dumbass.

2: "Amanda, if she does not resist adequately; that is, to the best of her ability, then she isn't being forced to have sex. She is letting it happen."
Say I walk up to you, put a gun to your head, and pulled the trigger after 30 seconds. By your reasoning I'm not a murderer, because you (let's assume) didn't fight back.

Geez, no wonder you're still in school.

Anonymous said...

Please get help, You're mentally ill and you don't even know it. It's not too late to get help.

Anonymous said...

Rape is an act of violence. A crime against another human being. It has nothing to do with feminism or anti-feminism. No means no in any language and coming from the mouth of any gender. Violently ignoring a person's denial is an abuse of strength and power -- whatever you gender.

Anonymous said...

I really hope you are trolling when you say you are glad women get raped. Go fuck yourself.

Believe me, I hate women who claim to have been raped, and are lying. A girl I knew in college pulled that shit, and it pissed me off to no end. But you can't say that *all* women are lying. It does happen. And coercion and mind games can lead to rape as well. So before you claim to have no pity for girls that have been raped, actually think for a minute. If you have a sister (which I doubt, because she should have smacked some sense into you by now), or a mother, imagine if she had been placed in a position where she had no choice. Imagine a girl in high school, lonely and afraid. Media shows her she's worthless. Society shows her she's worthless. When a man shows interest in her, might she want, at first to go along? Might she decide not to, and have him then force his way in? That is rape, and that is horrible.

I have a book for you. Reviving Ophelia. Please read it.

Also, not all feminists are evil, despite what you've been exposed to. I know the outspoken minority "man-haters" give the rest a bad name. In fact, a great many of my best guy friends consider themselves feminists.

Also, do you believe men can be raped by women? Why or why not?

Eivind Berge said...

But you can't say that *all* women are lying. It does happen.

Sure, but as long as the system is so rigged against men and the legal definition of rape is so corrupt, there can't be any harmony between the sexes or any sympathy from men for real rape victims, either. Check out the False Rape Society for how common false accusations are. We live in a feminist reign of terror where all a woman has to do is regret sex to get a man charged with rape. She doesn't even have to allege that she was actually raped, only that she didn't really consent, which does not make it rape. Rape is carnal knowledge of a woman, not one's wife by force and against her will. That's how common law used to define it and it meant she had to resist to the best of her ability. I can have sympathy for rape victims the day all feminist rape reform is quashed and the common-law definition is brought back. Until then, I mean what say in this blog post.

Also, do you believe men can be raped by women? Why or why not?

No, most certainly not! Because sex is a female resource. Women are sex objects and men are worthless. Most men are only eager to sleep with most women, but even if a man resists and is actually forced by a woman to have sex with her, he is only lucky, period. If he tried to pass himself off as a victim, I would spit in his face. Sympathy is the last thing he would get for his luxury problem. I've written more about this here.

Eivind Berge said...

Say I walk up to you, put a gun to your head, and pulled the trigger after 30 seconds. By your reasoning I'm not a murderer, because you (let's assume) didn't fight back.

No, this does not follow at all. Murder is not comparable to rape. You can't legally kill someone even if they consent, and murder does not require utmost resistance, unlike rape.

You don't think it's possible for a woman to be so terrified that they are basically unable to move?

Maybe, but then it would be impossible to prove. You can't convict a man for rape based solely on the state of mind of the woman. If she isn't credibly threatened with death or serious injury, and she doesn't resist to the best of her ability, it isn't rape, period. You need mens rea, too, but the feminists removed that ten years ago here in Norway, so now they are convicting men who didn't even intend to or realize that they were "raping." I simply can't have any concern for rape victims in such a system. The real victims are such a vanishingly small part of all accusations and rape trials that we can't take rape seriously anymore. That's what women get for trivializing the crime by diluting the definition to absurdity.

To all of you saying I am a sick human for defining rape as I do: This was the definition of rape for centuries until feminists corrupted it just a few decades ago. You are the sick ones.

Siv B. said...

You can scream until the end of time, the definition of rape is still sex with a person without consent. (kap 19 §200 i straffeloven)

Eivind Berge said...

Actually it is § 192 and the definition is this:

§ 192. Den som
a) skaffer seg seksuell omgang ved vold eller ved truende atferd, eller
b) har seksuell omgang med noen som er bevisstløs eller av andre grunner ute av stand til å motsette seg handlingen, eller
c) ved vold eller ved truende atferd får noen til å ha seksuell omgang med en annen, eller til å utføre tilsvarende handlinger med seg selv,

straffes for voldtekt med fengsel inntil 10 år. Ved vurderingen av om det er utøvd vold eller truende atferd eller om fornærmede var ute av stand til å motsette seg handlingen, skal det legges vekt på om fornærmede var under 14 år.

Straffen er fengsel i minst 2 år dersom
a) den seksuelle omgang var samleie, eller
b) den skyldige har fremkalt en tilstand som nevnt i første ledd bokstav b for å oppnå seksuell omgang.

Fengsel inntil 21 år kan idømmes dersom
a) voldtekten er begått av flere i fellesskap,
b) voldtekten er begått på en særlig smertefull eller særlig krenkende måte,
c) den skyldige tidligere er straffet etter denne bestemmelsen eller etter § 195, eller
d) den fornærmede som følge av handlingen dør eller får betydelig skade på legeme eller helse. Seksuelt overførbar sykdom og allmennfarlig smittsom sykdom, jf. smittevernloven § 1-3 nr. 3 jf. nr. 1, regnes alltid som betydelig skade på legeme eller helse etter denne paragrafen.

Den som ved grov uaktsomhet gjør seg skyldig i voldtekt etter første ledd, straffes med fengsel inntil 5 år. Foreligger omstendigheter som nevnt i tredje ledd, er straffen fengsel inntil 8 år.

Eivind Berge said...

§ 200 criminalizes "sexual acts" without consent that are not defined as sexual activity, such as touching. I very much disagree with this one too.

§ 200. Den som foretar seksuell handling med noen som ikke har samtykket til det, straffes med bøter eller fengsel inntil 1 år.

Den som foretar seksuell handling med barn under 16 år, straffes med fengsel inntil 3 år. Den som forleder barn under 16 år til å utvise seksuelt krenkende eller annen uanstendig atferd som nevnt i § 201, straffes med fengsel inntil 3 år.

I tilfelle som nevnt i annet ledd, kan fengsel inntil 6 år idømmes dersom handlingen er begått under særdeles skjerpende omstendigheter. Ved avgjørelsen av om særdeles skjerpende omstendigheter foreligger, skal det særlig legges vekt på hvor lang tid forholdet har pågått, om handlingen er misbruk av slektskapsforhold, omsorgsforhold, stilling, avhengighetsforhold eller nært tillitsforhold og om handlingen er begått på en særlig smertefull eller krenkende måte.

Anonymous said...

Bittersweet tragedy, mr. comedian. You cannot be for real. Why don´t you find your favorite knife and cut yourself, you worthless piece of shit? You must be very lonely. I hope you get hit by a car, ends up in a wheelchair with a stick to your forehead. I´ll read your retarded, misantrophic and misspelled blogs everyday. Promise.

Love from Oslo <3

Coyotemike said...

Ever hear of a knife, fucktard? Or scissors? You know, things that can cut cloth?

Wow, you are one of the dumbest people on earth. Really. You really should do us all a favor and stop breathing our air.

Anonymous said...

as an intelligent woman and human being (in that order), i have less faith in humanity after reading this blog.
you are bringing down the rest of society with your ignorant, sexist, idiotic posts.

furthermore, as a law student, there are so many flaws in your logic i found myself laughing at you.

be ashamed of yourself.

i have reported your site as abuse.

i hope you get hit by a bus.

Anonymous said...

your a retard, shut the hell up!

Another law student - Norwegian said...

Many or most of the comments here are no better than the blogger's own posts. Like attracts like?

And let me deal with this one in particular, among those few posts that aren't *quite* as scummy, freaky and misguided as the blogger's own

Lemish: "How tall are you? When do you plan on losing your virginity? Do you have nightmares about vaginas swallowing you whole?"

The last part, what's that about? As another male, I see that as an odd question - are you a psyche student?

And why ask about his height, with no reason given for this heightism? This should be about equal to a man asking a female blogger her weight, if she can't land a date - rude, obnoxious and stupid. Do you have an actual game plan, or are you just being another bubbleheaded modern woman? (Not that men, on average, are necessarily better, as far as I'm concerned.)

Anonymous said...

wishing death of any kind to a man that condones rape is not misguided, to defend this 'thing' in any way is the 'freakish' thing to do, and you're doing it.

fuck this fucking cunt his name is all over the internet i can't wait until someone rapes him or blows his fucking brains out, i'm sure it won't be long before one or the other happens and i will be happy when it does, hell, i might even do it myself (psst, i won't be doing any raping eivind, guess that just leaves me with the shotgun)

Chloe said...

I knew a man who was raped. He was a lovely guy. He was a virgin and his 'friends' held him down and a promiscuous girl (probably with many STIs) had her way with him in front of everyone. Her nickname was Maggot (deserved, too, from what I had heard). I bet it was humiliating and a horrid way to lose his virginity. The fact that you would spit in his face and tell him he was lucky shouldn't suprise me, I guess. Please don't reply to this post. I don't want to be subjected to any more of your mental illness.

Anonymous said...

You are an absolute horror of a human being.

Eivind Berge said...

Chloe, notice that most of the gullible fools who believe the lie about women being able to rape men are in fact women. What you don't realize is that you are being gamed. Pretending women can rape is an extreme version of that is called "stealing her frame" or "flipping the script." If a man can convince women that he is so desirable that women will actually force themselves on him, that is the ultimate pre-selection. He is playing you for a fool to get more pussy in the future. Other men can usually see through it, though.

Slime said...

The police in The Indian city of Pune have come up with stats that 74% of the rape cases are made up! So there is ahuge element of truth

Anonymous said...

I can't agree with Elvind on men not being able to be raped. No matter how many times he posts his ev bio studies, I'm not convinced.

I don't agree with him on the "right to rape". And I don't agree with him about it being a good thing when a woman is raped.

But you know what? I understand EXACTLY where he is coming from - in other words, I understand his feelings.

Let me put it this way: those of you who don't want to blow a judges head off for some of the abmominations that Elvin has written about, those who don't care or worry about false accusations, double and triple jeaopardy but come here just to bash Elvind - Well, for the ladies, I hope you are brutally raped, and for the men I hope you are beat badly or sexually assaulted.

You see, I refuse to use the excuse that rape is a horrible crime to turn a blind eye to the injustices that have so twisted and hurt Elvind and even more so the innocent or ignorant men caught up in their webs. I've criticised Elvind before, and to an extent this post is one of his most horrible. But you know something? If compassion was shown to him about his legitimate complaints perhaps he would be able to show a bit more compassion to others.

Clarence

Chloe said...

Clarence,

What a disgusting thing to say. I would never wish for anyone to be hurt: judge, Evind, or otherwise, and wishing someone is raped for not sharing your opinions makes you just as bad as Evind is.

Chloe said...

*Eivind, rather.

Anonymous said...

Chloe:

Do you apply that standard to the other comments in this thread where they specifically wish harm to Elvind? If not, why not?

And we fucking get that rape can be a horrible crime. So's murder. So is repeated assaults, physical or sexual as those who are falsely convicted of rape are often subjected to.

Really, I have no desire to have a victimology contest with you. How does rape being a horrible crime have anything to do with the horrible crimes being committed in the name of combating it?

I don't apologize for feeling no compassion for people who have no compassion for men falsely accused.
Personally I rather wish the Anti-rape crusaders and the rapists would both banish off the face of the Earth. Together they've done more harm to innocent men and women than I can even think to quantify. But I will say where the feminist anti rape crusaders go wrong:
A. Asserting rape is a sex based act that benefits men as a class. A disgusting lie and slander
B. Attempting to eliminate rape by any means necessary. No evil is ever totally eradicated from the world, and attempting to turn the legal rules that protect innocents inside and out to get convictions without a care in the world about false convictions shows just how bigoted and stupid these people are.

Clarence

Chloe said...

Clarence:

'Do you apply that standard to the other comments in this thread where they specifically wish harm to Elvind?'

Yes, I do.

Eivand thinks that women deserve to be be raped.
You think that women deserve to be raped.

You are both frightening to me because you attempt to rationalise this stance.

'How does rape being a horrible crime have anything to do with the horrible crimes being committed in the name of combating it?'

I don't see how the above has anything to do with what I wrote.

My point is that you said you criticise Eivan, and that his post is horrible, but then put forward the same sentiment. That certain people deserve to be raped.

'I don't apologize for feeling no compassion for people who have no compassion for men falsely accused.'

There is a difference for feeling no compassion, and wishing someone personal harm, and telling them they should be raped.

Who said 'these people' (presumably you are talking about the ones who come here 'to bash Eivind') don't have compassion for those falsely accused anyway? I haven't seen anyone say that a man who is falsely accused 'deserved what he got'.

Compassion or not, wishing people personal harm is...f*cked up.

Chloe said...

Correction:

'There is a difference for feeling no compassion'

'There is a difference BETWEEN feeling no compassion'

Anonymous said...

Chloe:

Well, I'm glad you understand the difference between "some" women deserve to be raped, and "all" women deserve to be raped.

Just as there's a difference between "some" people deserving the death penalty, and saying "all" people deserve the death penalty.

I consider some of those commenting on this thread to be "false rape apologists", and I have no more pity or mercy for them then they'd have for a man convicted of rape who swore the "slut deserved it" because she was wearing a short skirt and "fuck me" boots.

Once again , the reprehensible parts of Elvinds worldview are at least partly explained by the reprehensible parts of the world and legal system he lives in.

Action, reaction. If you kick a dog, it will bite? Why isn't this so hard to understand and if you are going to "put the dog down", why not at least try to save other dogs, by reducing the amount of kicks in this world?

I'll tell you why: bigotry and propaganda.

Anonymous said...

That previous post was mine.

Clarence

Chloe said...

Clarence, I cannot tell if you are being saracastic or not. I intentionally did not say that either you or Eivind believe *all* women should be raped (I recall Eivind actually stating elsewhere on this blog that he does not extend his rape-wish to all women, in his response to some peoples' questions).

If you aren't being sarastic, then ignore this message. If you are, please note that Eivind has said there are some cases where women shouldn't be raped, so I left out the article intenionally for both of you. You can add the 'some' in, if it makes you feel better about yourself; that you only wish rape on certain people.

It doesn't make a difference to what I believe, which is that NO women (or men, for that matter) should be raped.

As for the rest of your post, I honestly don't believe Eivind has been 'kicked'. I think he has a mental disorder. I am not qualified on such matters, though, but his opinion does seem quite 'unique' for someone from a progressive country (I had never heard Norway described as a 'reprehensible part of the world' before you just did).

Anonymous said...

Wishing death or pain on people who wish the same against you or act in such a manner as to victimize you is a fully natural human reaction.

However, I'm going to run a test here.

Chloe, is it important for men or women accused of sexual offences including rape to have a fair trial without presumption of guilt, or not? And secondly, is worrying about false accusations and taking them into account when conducting anti-rape efforts a moral thing to do or not?

Thanks in advance for your answers.

Clarence

P.S. Norway can be a shitty place to live in some ways,for instance if the rape laws are as fucked up as Elvind claims they are. It's not like anyone in this thread has bothered to prove him wrong. Paradise doesn't exist on this Earth, and Stalin's Russia claimed to be "progressive". And when one focuses on effects and what people do rather than what they claim to be about, one quickly finds far more evil and gray areas in this world, often claiming the mantle of truth, justice, or good.

Chloe said...

Clarence, the aswers to your questions are yes, and yes.

I as not sure why you are asking them though, because I don't see what they have to do with my post...

Do you also live in Norway? I haven't seen anything "fucked up" on here about Norway's rape laws. I have not read Eivind's entire blog. What I have seen is that he disagrees with the definition of rape not including women fighting back "to the best of their ability".

If you have seen something else that could be classified as "fucked up" (in the way Eivind's attitude is also "fucked up") I would be interested to see it.

By the way, I wasn't referring to Norway's CLAIMS of being progressive, but their reputation throughout the rest of the world.

Chloe said...

Sorry, I missed this part of your post "Wishing death or pain on people who wish the same against you or act in such a manner as to victimize you is a fully natural human reaction.".

I do not think that you can justify this position for either yourself or Eivid, sorry. How have you been victimised, by who, and why would you thik it is natural to want to hurt nameless people (who didn't do the deed) as revenge? It may be natural (everything you feel is natural), but it ain't normal, it is sociopathic.

Anonymous said...

Chloe:

Firstly , you misunderstand sociopathic. A sociopath is extremely inner directed, some would say narcissistic, and has no feelings for other people. He or she can not "put themselves in someone else's shoes" emotionally, nor do they apparently have the normal range of emotions most people do.

Secondly, the people who I wouldn't mind seeing hurt (not whom *I* wished to hurt personally) are those who attack Elvind but not the symptoms that produce Elvind. They are incapable of having mercy and compassion towards him and often towards ideological opponnents yet they want people to feel sorry for their causes.

I call bullshit on the whole thing. You will not solve sexual violence issues by looking at only one side of the equation, you will not have a successful social justice movement by claiming that either some victims don't exist or that some victims aren't worth caring about.

Hoping that some of the commenters on this thread receive what they are only too willing to dish out is not narcissim but a desire for justice. Elvind, despite his views has done nothing personally wrong to anyone and because of that he deserves to be treated like a human being with feelings and worries.

Now as to my test.

You answered correctly, and have shown you have some basis of compassion and morality in your heart. You'd be surprised about how many self proclaimed anti rape activists fail either due to prejudice or hatred or both, and simply can not bring themselves to answer questions like that, or resort to name calling or try to change the subject. If many of the anti rape activist organizations were run by people such as yourself there might be some common ground after all. But all too often they are run by ideologues who ignore lesbian DV and sexual assualt, claim women never assault men, claim women never lie about rape, and claim that in a country where as recently as 1947 seven black men were hung at the word of a white woman alone, uncorroberated with other evidence we have this huge "rape culture". Lastly the things said about male sexuality are offensive and wrong and tend to conflate the sins of the few with that of the many.

But rather than criticize the leaders of a political movement that can get laws shifted and changed often to the deterement of innocent men and women, you prefer to pretend that Elvind, a single guy living in Norway with no power is a huge threat that needs to lose his ability to hold a job or indeed walk around safely in society.

And yes, Elvinds has laid down on this blog his case against Norways laws. If true, I find them ridiculoulsly unfair myself - unfair to such an extent that they can almost be called a declaration of war on the rights of men accused of rape. You should check it out, but I suspect you are afraid of what you might find.

As I've said, few things are unabashedly a good thing in this world and power hungry politicians always love a crusade. Witness America's war on "sexual predators".

Clarence

Once again, I'm hating on the haters. Karma, it's called. You get what you give. I wish no pain on the billions of innocent women, men, and children in this world. I see Elvind as human and needing help, and his views are not drawn from thin air but rather from a reaction to injustice that exists in the wider world around him.

Chloe said...

Like I said, I think anyone who wishes rape on others is disgusting, and your last post didnt convince me otherwise.

"But rather than criticize the leaders of a political movement that can get laws shifted and changed often to the deterement of innocent men and women, you prefer to pretend that Elvind, a single guy living in Norway with no power is a huge threat that needs to lose his ability to hold a job or indeed walk around safely in society."

I prefer? Never have I said anything along those lies. You either mistyped, misread, or are projecting.

Chloe said...

oops, lies=lines.

Another law student - Norwegian said...

"By the way, I wasn't referring to Norway's CLAIMS of being progressive, but their reputation throughout the rest of the world."

- What exactly is so progressive about Norway, in a legal sense? Our justice system is full of daily fuck-ups, and quite a few miscarriages of justice (justismord, på norsk), and there are plenty of false rape charges. I can back this up without the slightest of problems, but not if you can't read articles in Norwegian. Are there people out there who believe that there are countries where human nature is different than in the rest of the world? Norwegians are every bit as prejudiced and bigoted as your average western nation - perhaps even more than most (we have one of the largest, anti-immigration populist parties in existence in the western world).

The Norwegian police have been criticized by English law professors for flagrant abuses of human rights, and Norwegian court rulings are among those most frequently being overturned by the European Court of Human Rights (the one in Strasbourg).

Also, Norway and Sweden are probably the most feminist states in the world.

Emily said...

I would just like to point out a couple things. First of all, just because the definition of rape you offered was the accepted definition for centuries does not mean that it is the correct definition. That having been said, you do have a point about the true impact of rape being diluted by false accusations and - I am sorry to say it - trivial definitions. Nevertheless, true rape is not as uncommon as you make it out to be, and since, at least in North America, the burden of proof is on the victim (or the prosecution who acts in his or her name) there are many rapists who do not get convicted for their crimes, and many more who are never brought to trial at all. Similarly, if you want to prove that false rape is the norm, (that is to say, if you want to be taken seriously) you need to cite a more reputable source than the False Rape Society. I believe you said you are a philosophy student, and I know philosophers aren't hung up on "facts" per se, but still. Try to be a bit more professional here.
I am also curious about your assertion that men cannot be raped by women. What if a gay man was held down and forced to have intercourse with a woman? That man could not be considered to be "lucky" to have sex with a woman, because such a man never sought to have sex with women at all, ever.
Finally, Clarence: though you profess to be a critic of Eivind, you are really no better. I'm sorry to have to be the one to point this out, but saying that "those of you who don't want to blow a judges head off for some of the abmominations that Elvin has written about, those who don't care or worry about false accusations, double and triple jeaopardy but come here just to bash Elvind - Well, for the ladies, I hope you are brutally raped, and for the men I hope you are beat badly or sexually assaulted" is just as horrible and misguided. The same goes for those of you who wish Eivind harm though. No matter how you might feel about him, even if he did get hit by a bus, there would be another guy to take his place. Lets focus on achieving mutual understanding instead.

Anonymous said...

Emily:

At least you are equal in your condemnations. I can respect that.

And really? Unless one renounces violence (self defense is an exception) in all its forms against all groups and individuals including those one finds reprehensible in view points then one really can't claim to be on some higher moral or ethical plane. So I'm human.

If it makes you feel better, I do feel genuine sympathy for about 99 percent of all rape victims I hear about, male or female. Alas, my compassion is perhaps more limited than yours. I do not say this in any kind of happy manner, but as a supporter of the death penalty I can't very well feel too guilty about wishing what I regard as a lesser punishment on someone. Lesser in comparison to death.

Though I disagree with you about your various philosophical weighings of the evils being discussed, I wish both you and Chloe well. This place is very heartless at times because Elvind has such an extreme viewpoint, half the people come here to make fun or attack him, and the other half to marvel at a human "monster". That's rather sad when one thinks about it because monsters are almost always made, not born.

Clarence

Emily said...

Clarence: I agree, monsters are made, and I totally agree that we need to consider revising the system to help alleviate some of the injustices. However, I don't think violence is ever the answer to injustice - not that the compulsion isn't warranted or completely, but 9 times out of 10 it merely compounds the issue. You're correct that I cannot claim to be on a higher moral or ethical plane necessarily - no one can. But to wish violence on someone just because they have a different approach to an issue than you do is not really constructive.

Emily said...

*completely understandable

Anonymous said...

I would rather you come to my house right now and slit my throat than be raped by anyone.
Of course you'll want to rape my dead body when your done, but you'll know when you look into my blank stare that you're really raping yourself.

Katie said...

I really am one who tries very hard to look at something from alternate points of view, and to understand where people are coming from.

But I actually gave myself a headache trying to figure out how you could possibly have this attitude. What's worse: why you want to BROADCAST such views?

I understand that some positive social changes have been made because people broadcast ideals that are otherwise frowned upon, but this does not appear positive in any way. And I'm not simply saying that because that's the consensus, either.

I do, however, understand how someone could be so obsessed with this topic, obsessed enough to blog about it regularly. I am not a man-hater, but I do resent some of the stereotypes there are about women, just as men resent the stereotypes about men.

The only way to really overcome these stereotypes is for people to be the best human beings they can be, which includes not wishing for or reveling in the misfortune of others.

Anonymous said...

All women are whores and most women are bitches. Women deserve to get beaten, raped killed.

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Anonymous said...

Agreed 100%. The so called men who come here only to leave insults or wish you dead are the ones who should feel ashamed of themselves.

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